Things People "Know" about the Bible

[BOC560]

Pastor Cole recently completed a study on Paltalk concerning angels according to scripture.

It seems the average person today has very little knowledge of bible scripture.  What they do have is a lot of beliefs that seem to be based upon emotion and superstition.  The sad thing is that they prefer to stand firm in their baseless religion rather than to accept truth when it is presented to them.

In a recent obituary, the bereaved writes; “Sarah Elizabeth Buckalew, 19, Kokomo, was granted her permanent angel wings at 8:20 p. m…”

http://www.kokomotribune.com/obituaries/local_story_146003855.html

While this is probably not the best time to open a conversation about sensitive theological misconceptions, we should note at least three of them;

   1. Humans do not become angels when they die.
   2. No angels in scripture were ever depicted as female.
   3. Angels do not have wings.

Most people who willfully believe such common “knowledge” about the bible are often quite obstinate in the matter.  This seems to be particularly so for preachers and learned theologians.  They predominately agree that Peter and Paul taught the same gospel message and that Christians today are Israelites (spiritually speaking) with the Kingdom of God being within them.

Johnny (BOC560)

[Lu]

Also, from my notes on the program:

Angels are not necessary for today.
Walk by faith, not by sight.
Angels are in the earthly ministries, not during the Dispensation of Grace.
The Holy Spirit is better than angels.
We are complete in Him.
No angels coming down for prayer now,
the Spirit of God helps us pray.
Angels ministered to Israel.
Angels are learning from watching us today.
Angels are fascinated by God's wisdom and the redemption plan.
Someday we will judge angels.
The armies in heaven are angels.

YFIC,  Lu

 

[Snaggle3]

I was able to listen to most of the series on Angels and enjoyed it.  Apparently a big controversy developed over the statement that when Jesus ascended and was taken up by a cloud the cloud was a cloud of angels. 

Acts 1:9-12 9And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.  10And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.  12Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

[Christine]

I was able to listen to most of the series on Angels and enjoyed it.  Apparently a big controversy developed over the statement that when Jesus ascended and was taken up by a cloud the cloud was a cloud of angels. 

Acts 1:9-12 9And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.  10And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.  12Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

The controversy developed due to several (and they shall remain un-named) "novices" thinking that because THEY had never heard that clouds oftentimes represent angels in the scriptures, that this was "heretical teaching" and they began the ball rolling once again to try and sow discord among the brethren. Interestingly enough, its always the same people who do this every time.

These unfortunate folks are not online to study and learn, but to develop a following for themselves. We have somehow become a popular "target" for them as we do not respond in kind, nor do we go to their rooms to gather "ammunition" to try and discredit them. We are there simply to edify the Body and to preach and teach Gods plan and purpose.

Unfortunately, even amongst grace believers, jealousy and pride and all sorts of various and sundry "ugliness" runs amok. There are those who LIVE for the controversy, instead of encouraging and building UP the Body, they revel in tearing it down.

We all should be careful and aware that these things ARE taking place so that we don't become ensnared in the same trap.

[Christine]

Also, from my notes on the program:

Angels are not necessary for today.
Walk by faith, not by sight.
Angels are in the earthly ministries, not during the Dispensation of Grace.
The Holy Spirit is better than angels.
We are complete in Him.
No angels coming down for prayer now,
the Spirit of God helps us pray.
Angels ministered to Israel.
Angels are learning from watching us today.
Angels are fascinated by God's wisdom and the redemption plan.
Someday we will judge angels.
The armies in heaven are angels.

YFIC,  Lu

 

Wow, Lu...you WERE listening!! Good for you...I am a big fan of note taking myself!

[Oasis]

I was going through my library and scanned through a book by David Jeremiah, "What the Bible says about Angels".  I'd read it several years ago, before we came to right dividing, and we had listened to the cd series too.  At the time it sounded good, but now scanning back through it, I saw the mixing of signs and wonders verses for Israel with the faith by sight verses for the Body of Christ today.  I also saw more opiniion and supposition about angels and their role today, than actual facts. 

For the umpteenth time in the last few years this book and cd series and several more went in file 13.  My library has shrunk significantly in the last few years.

Time and again I read quotes from David Jeremiah, Billy Graham, and others in this book that claimed to have felt the presence of angels in times of need. 
I think the Holy Spirit is sufficient, don't you?

Romans 8:26
"Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." 

ybiC,
Kab

[Christine]

I was going through my library and scanned through a book by David Jeremiah, "What the Bible says about Angels".  I'd read it several years ago, before we came to right dividing, and we had listened to the cd series too.  At the time it sounded good, but now scanning back through it, I saw the mixing of signs and wonders verses for Israel with the faith by sight verses for the Body of Christ today.  I also saw more opiniion and supposition about angels and their role today, than actual facts. 

For the umpteenth time in the last few years this book and cd series and several more went in file 13.  My library has shrunk significantly in the last few years.

Time and again I read quotes from David Jeremiah, Billy Graham, and others in this book that claimed to have felt the presence of angels in times of need. 
I think the Holy Spirit is sufficient, don't you?

Romans 8:26
"Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." 

ybiC,
Kab

Amen kab! My library seems to have done the same thing YOURS did....curious isn't it? Most of the books on "Christian" bookshelves are little more than excursions into "feelings oriented" superstition, instead of faith based FACTS. Since when did "feeling" something make anything TRUE?? Hello??? But the hits just keep on comin, don't they? People falling over under the power of the Spirit (find THAT one in the Bible for me) and barking like dogs or squawking like chickens.....Puleeeeze.

They don't understand that God is not displaying His POWER today, but is showing His manifold wisdom thru the church which is His Body. His SECRET plan for the ages which was on the table BEFORE the world even began, and kept HID in God until due time. What an awesome plan. Not even satan could ruin it as he had NO Idea that God would save the world thru the death, burial and resurrection of His Son on the Cross.

We are to be stewards of the mysteries of God...those mysteries that He has REVEALED and that satan wants to keep HIDDEN.

Gods manifold WISDOM is awesome indeed, and we DON'T need anything more than He has  provided. Aint it just toooooooooo kewl??

[Oasis]

Johnny

It seems the average person today has very little knowledge of bible scripture.  What they do have is a lot of beliefs that seem to be based upon emotion and superstition.  The sad thing is that they prefer to stand firm in their baseless religion rather than to accept truth when it is presented to them.

You're right Johnny.  I see it everywhere I go, now.  People are afraid to leave their comfort zone and are not willing to delve deeper into the Word of God "...to see if these things be true..."-Acts 17:11.  Many times this can expose people to things they would not fall for if they knew their Scripture. 

Christine

Since when did "feeling" something make anything TRUE?? Hello??? But the hits just keep on comin, don't they? People falling over under the power of the Spirit (find THAT one in the Bible for me) and barking like dogs or squawking like chickens.....Puleeeeze.

Exactly Christine.  People elevate experience over absolute Truth.  The Bible becomes nothing more than a general guideline.

I've had an interest in studying legalistic sects and cults for many years now.  I'm sure it stems, at least in part, from the fact that I was born and raised in a legalistic sect called the Non-instrumental Church of Christ.  It's the same sect TC came out of.  I think the best and briefest definition of what defines a cult from a Christian perspective is the following:

"A separate religious group generally claiming compatibility with Christianity but whose doctrines contradict those of historic Christianity and whose practices and ethical standards violate those of Biblical Christianity."
Source-Encyclopedia of Cults and New Religions

Now, why am I telling you guys/gals all of this?  Well, you could break this definition down into several categories, but for the discussion of angels there is one Biblical doctrine involved, in particular, that cults universally reject.  That is the denial of the Holy Trinity.  I mention this one because many cult founders and leaders claim to have been visited, assisted, and given personal revelation both in the beginning and throughout their ministries, but not through the Holy Trinity. 

Cults de-emphasis the existence, authority, and power of the Trinity.  They elevate the authority and power of angels.  Probably the best known cult of this flavor is Mormonism, which I believe to be the most powerful and deceptive cult on the planet.  I've you've never read an account of the "vision" of Joseph Smith this might interest you.  This is an excerpt of one of three contradicting accounts of the "vision" he had, and the one the Mormon church officially embraces.  In 1820 while walking in the woods and stopping to kneel in prayer Smith recounts,

"I had scarcely done so(stopped to kneel in prayer), when immediately I was seized upon by some power which entirely overcame me, and had such an astonishing influence over me as to bind my tongue so that I could not speak.  Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction.
But, exerting all my powers to call upon God to deliver me out of the power of this enemy which had seized upon me, and at the very moment which I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction--not to an imaginary ruin, but to the power of some actual being from the unseen world, who had such marvelous power as I had never before felt in any being--just at this moment of great alarm, I saw a pillar of light exactly over my head, above the brightness of the sun, which descended gradually until it fell upon me."

Smith goes on to say that there were two figures in the air above him.  He claims they were God and His Son, Jesus Christ.  It should be noted that he gave 8 different accounts of this event over the years and at least three that I know of are completely contradictory.  A few years after the original vision he claimed to have had a "revelation" in his bedroom from an angel named "Moroni".  There were contradictory versions of this too, that the Mormon Church covered up. 

Where am I going with this?  We know that the Mormon religion is completely apostate and is a lie from the pits of hell, itself.  This "pillar of light" Smith says appeared to him also has appeared to and accompanied others through their apostate teaching.  William Branham is another visited by a "pillar of light".  There was a "light in the opening of the window in the room Branham was born in, and his life was filled with and influenced by claims of visitations, visions, and revelations from angels.  Branham was a faith healer and claimed that a certain "angel was with him night and day."  He stated that he was "unable to minister unless the angel was at his side."  In a book(The Revelation of the Seven Seals p. 112-113)Branham writes, "If you haven't made preparation yet to meet the Lamb in the air, and by the power invested in me by my commission given by Almighty God and ministered to me by an Angel, A PILLAR OF LIGHT."

"For such men are false apostles, seceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ.  And no wonder as Satan himself maqerades as an angel of light.  It is not surprising then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness.  Their end will be what their actions deserve."-2 Corinthians 11:13-15

"But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preache to you, let him be eternally condemned!  As we have already said, so now I say again:  If anybody is preaching to you another gospel other than what you accepted let him be eternally condemned!"-Galatians 1:8-9

"But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there are false teachers among you.  They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who brought them-bringing swift destruction on themselves."-2 Peter 2:1

"Dear friends do no believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world."-1 John 4:1

The only way to know what to stand against is to know what you stand for.

Note:  Smith and Branham were both ministered to by a "pillar of light".  It's important to note that both Smith and his parents, and Branham and his parents were heavily involved in occultism.  They both embraced Egytian occultism and both claimed visitation and revelation from a pillar of light and angels.  Branham's ministry and writings have contributed greatly to the emergent church movement that include people like Rick Warren...and the Southern Baptists just love Rick Warren.   They and many others are incredibly blinded to the apostacy he teaches.  It always comes back to 1 John 4:1, quoted above.

ybiC,
Kab